Christ is come in Flesh and Who Died at the Cross – Interesting thoughts

 

  • 1Jo:4:2: Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: 3: And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
  • 2Jo:1:7: For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

 

“At the Saviour’s baptism, Satan was among the witnesses. He saw the Father’s glory overshadowing His Son. He heard the voice of Jehovah testifying to the divinity of Jesus. Ever since Adam’s sin, the human race had been cut off from direct communion with God; the intercourse between heaven and earth had been through Christ; BUT NOW THAT JESUS HAD COME “in the likeness of sinful flesh” (Romans 8:3), THE FATHER HIMSELF SPOKE. HE HAD BEFORE COMMUNICATED WITH HUMANITY –>THROUGH<– CHRIST; NOW HE COMMUNICATED WITH HUMANITY –>IN<– CHRIST. Satan had hoped that God’s abhorrence of evil would bring an eternal separation between heaven and earth. But now it was manifest that the connection between God and man had been restored.” DA 116.2

 

“Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that JESUS CHRIST –>IS COME<– IN THE FLESH is of God: And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ IS come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.” — 1 John 4:2-3 (KJV)

 

One must say with John, “Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God; because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God; and every spirit that confesseth not that JESUS CHRIST IS COME IN THE FLESH is not of God; and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.” What definite light God has given us in this chapter. It becomes every soul to be sure that CHRIST IS FORMED WITHIN, the hope of glory. O let us constantly walk humbly with God. We need now that living faith which takes God at His word. We are not to allow any discouraging features of opposition to depress our souls. It would not be for the glory of God for us to become discouraged. We are living amidst the closing scenes of this earth’s history, and we must now like Jacob cling to Jesus with all our power, exclaiming, “I will not let Thee go except Thou bless me, even me.” Hold fast to the promises of God.” {Lt335-1905.8-9} – EGW

 

“Where are you standing, brethren and sisters? Do you take hold of the death of Christ by faith and make it your salvation? Then we have made a new beginning and all our past life is as though it had not been. It is God’s life we are to live. God wants us to keep walking right along with Him. When we receive Him we are made free and sin no more. Why do we sin? We do not understand God’s sufficiency. He will reveal Himself in our hearts. We have had in our Sabbath school lessons that when we confess that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, WE ARE TO CONFESS THAT HE HAS COME –>IN<–OUR FLESH. We have laid aside our own sins and we are living to the glory of God.” {Ms15-1894.23} – EGW

 

I think “Christ within” gives us that access to the Father, we can say that, not unlike how Father spoke directly to Jesus during baptism, the word of God (Father) can reach us or experienced directly IN our flesh. As he spoke from the throne his Spirit direct to his son so through Christ everything is accessible to us DA 21.2. Christ breathed his spirit to his disciples John 20:22, He breathed to the dry bones Ezekiel 37:3-10, and breathed in the nostril of Adam Gen 2:7. He can give us his Spirit directly without using other channels. God is not limited as human beings are.

 

Here’s the difference between the OT and the NT:

“During the patriarchal age the influence of the Holy Spirit had often been revealed in a marked manner, BUT NEVER IN ITS FULLNESS. Now, in obedience to the word of the Saviour, the disciples offered their supplications for this gift, and in heaven Christ added His intercession. HE CLAIMED THE GIFT OF THE SPIRIT, that He might POUR IT upon His people.” — (E.G. White, AA, p.37)

 

“In times past holy men of old spake as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. In ancient times the prophets searched what the Spirit of God which was in them signified. THE SPIRIT WAS NOT THEN GIVEN IN POWER BECAUSE JESUS WAS NOT YET GLORIFIED. Dating from the day of Pentecost, the Holy Spirit was to be poured forth on sons and daughters, on servants and handmaidens. In every hill country, every lowland, every valley, humble workmen for the Lord are to be raised up. The divine, sacred influence of the Holy Spirit working in our world is to be as signs and wonders, because God’s people are a peculiar people, an holy nation, shining amid moral darkness as living stones in the Lord’s building. The weakest and feeblest, if they exercise faith in God, and improve their entrusted powers, will be elevated, refined and perfected in character under the Holy Spirit’s working. Humble and contrite, they submit to the moulding and fashioning of the Spirit, and they will know what His eternal fulness means.” {RH February 7, 1957, par. 2}

 

“During His humiliation upon this earth, the SPIRIT HAD NOT DESCENDED WITH ALL ITS EFFICACY; and Christ declared that if He went not away, it would not come, but that if He went away, He would send it. It was a representation of Himself, and after He was glorified it was manifest.” {ST, May 17, 1899 par. 3}

 

Interesting stuff there from EGW but I believe just as Kellogg was saying the same things she was saying yet she denied to be in harmony with him so others maybe saying the same things she said but differing with what she meant

 

  1. J. Waggoner The Present Truth | May 18, 1893; Excerpt from: “A Present Salvation.” “So it is that “every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God” (1 John 4:2, 3). Note again the present tense. It is not enough to confess that Jesus Christ did come in the flesh; that will bring no salvation to anybody. We must confess, from positive knowledge that Jesus IS JUST NOW come in the flesh, and then we are of God. Christ came in the flesh eighteen hundred years ago, just for the purpose of demonstrating the possibility. THAT WHICH HE DID ONCE, HE IS ABLE TO DO IT AGAIN. HE WHO DENIES THE POSSIBILITY OF HIS COMING IN THE FLESH OF MEN NOW, THEREBY DENIES THE POSSIBILITY OF HIS HAVING EVER COME IN THE FLESH.

 

“So our part is with humbleness of mind to confess that we are sinners; that in us is no good thing. If we do not, then the truth is not in us; but if we do, then Christ, who came into the world for the express purpose of saving sinners, will come and take up His abode within us, and then the truth will indeed be in us. Then there will be perfection manifested in the midst of imperfection. There will be completeness in the midst of weakness. We “are complete in Him” (Col. 2:10). He has created all things by the word of His power, and therefore can take men who are but nothing, and can make them “to the praise of the glory of His grace” (Eph. 1:6). “For of Him, and through Him, and to Him are all things, to whom be the glory forever. Amen” (Rom. 11:36).

 

Think about this, Christ came in the flesh 1800 years ago, what does it mean? Divinity was able to be housed in a human nature and so it’s not just enough to believe that but have an experiential knowledge of being partakers of divine nature, humanity combining with divinity then we shall not sin.

 

AT Jones then explains how “he has created all things by the word of his power…..”

 

The word then became flesh and we saw its glory, the glory of the only begotten of God. If this happens to us then this is what we commence the Loud Cry because the whole world will be filled with the glory of God by those who have been adopted as sons of God. Let the word of God richly dwell in you.

 

The pantheistic view of Christ is come in flesh should be guarded. So, what’s the significance change post-incarnation with how the Father related to humans onwards? Before that he spoke through his divine son, after, he spoke in humanity to men, Christ had emptied himself of this divine glory, divinity in human flesh interacted with fallen men in their own likeness without consuming them. God was in Christ reconciling men to himself. In this state, the whole heaven was put at stake because there was a possibility of Christ failing, he risked heaven itself while he fully divine there was no risk. It’s strange also to note that EGW says the time when divinity combined with humanity is not yet revealed. Her quote has also perplexed me. Wasn’t divinity combined with humanity when the fetus began to be formed in Mary’s womb?!

 

He was tempted in all points like as man is tempted, yet He is called “that holy thing.” Verse 35. It is a mystery that is left unexplained to mortals that Christ could be tempted in all points like as we are, and yet be without sin. The incarnation of Christ has ever been, and will ever remain, a mystery. That which is revealed is for us and for our children, but let every human being be warned from the ground of making Christ altogether human, such an one as ourselves, for it cannot be. The exact time when humanity blended with divinity, it is not necessary for us to know. We are to keep our feet on the Rock, Christ Jesus, as God revealed in humanity. [Lt8-1895.17]

 

John 3:8: The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

 

This is the mystery of Christ is come in flesh, this is the mystery of Christ in us the hope of glory, this is the mystery of being partakers of divine nature. The wind blowing where it listeth and inhabiting the sons of men who exercise faith in the promise those who have the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus

 

At his death, because the divinity could not function without the human being alive; the only time that divinity lied in the ground of the earth, first time that communication with the Father could not exist. This was infinite sacrifice for divinity to be irresponsive. This is divine sundering, the stroke of death rendered divinity dormant. Jesus was in prison for allotted time [There was only one entrance to the tomb, and neither human fraud nor force could tamper with the stone that guarded the entrance. Here Jesus rested during the Sabbath. A strong guard of angels kept watch over the tomb, and had a hand been raised to remove the body, the flashing forth of their glory would have laid him who ventured powerless on the earth. He who died for the sins of the world was to remain in the tomb for the allotted time. He was in that stony prison house as a prisoner of divine justice, and he was responsible to the Judge of the universe. He was bearing the sins of the world, and his Father only could release him. {YI, May 2, 1901 par. 8}] [Jesus said to Mary, “Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father.” When he closed his eyes in death upon the cross, the soul of Christ did not go at once to Heaven, as many believe, or how could his words be true–“I am not yet ascended to my Father”? The spirit of Jesus slept in the tomb with his body, and did not wing its way to Heaven, there to maintain a separate existence, and to look down upon the mourning disciples embalming the body from which it had taken flight. All that comprised the life and intelligence of Jesus remained with his body in the sepulcher; and when he came forth it was as a whole being; he did not have to summon his spirit from Heaven. He had power to lay down his life and to take it up again. {6Red 22.1}

 

For Christ to resurrect the power of the most high, the glory of the Father, his spirit had to overshadow his body. [“And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven.” Clothed with the panoply of God, this angel left the heavenly courts. The bright beams of God’s glory went before him, and illuminated his pathway. “His countenance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow: and for fear of him the keepers did shake, and became as dead men.” …. This messenger is he who fills the position from which Satan fell. It is he who on the hills of Bethlehem proclaimed Christ’s birth. The earth trembles at his approach, the hosts of darkness flee, and as he rolls away the stone, heaven seems to come down to the earth. The soldiers see him removing the stone as he would a pebble, and hear him cry, Son of God, come forth; Thy Father calls Thee. They see Jesus come forth from the grave, and hear Him proclaim over the rent sepulcher, “I am the resurrection, and the life.” As He comes forth in majesty and glory, the angel host bow low in adoration before the Redeemer, and welcome Him with songs of praise. {DA 779. 2, 3}. When the divine spirit comes in contact with humanity and overshadows it, life is begotten. The disconnect through divine sundering is restored. The glory which he came from the tomb with was that panoply from the throne of that accompanied the angels. God gave him glory [1Peter 1:21]

 

Hebrew 10:5 a body, hardware was prepared to house this software, the divinity. Two individualities each retained its own existence [Our Lord was tempted as man is tempted. He was capable of yielding to temptations, as are human beings. His finite nature was pure and spotless, but the divine nature that led Him to say to Philip, “He that hath seen Me hath seen the Father” also, was not humanized; neither was humanity deified by the blending or union of the two natures; each retained its essential character and properties. {Ms57-1890}]. But for the divinity to work humanity had to be alive. Humanity was the eclipse and if it were to be removed and only divinity remain, no one could have survived the presence [But although Christ’s divine glory was for a time veiled and eclipsed by His assuming humanity, yet He did not cease to be God when He became man. The human did not take the place of the divine, nor the divine of the human. This is the mystery of godliness. The two expressions human and divine were, in Christ, closely and inseparably one, and yet they had a distinct individuality. Though Christ humbled Himself to become man, the Godhead was still His own. His Deity could not be lost while He stood faithful and true to His loyalty. …. He was ready to take once more His divine glory when His work on earth was done. {ST, May 10, 1899 par. 11}] [He trod our earth as man. He had reason, conscience, memory, will, and affections of the human soul which was united with His divine nature. {Ms57-1890}]

 

If we try to separate the two distinct individualities at his death, then the sacrifice is human and not divine, its not infinite. Its the sundering of divinity of the Father and Son at the cross that made it infinite. A divine person had just forfeited the functioning of divinity by being made sin and the two could not correspond with each other. Think about this, we are separated from the Father because of sin and Christ is the mediator, divinity grasping to divinity and humanity reaching to humanity because of his spotlessness, when he accepted to be a sin-bearer in Gethsemane, divinity which cannot come into conduct with sin was now severed, there was gradual withdrawal of the communication between his divinity and humanity and because divinity could not remain functional without the humanity being alive, it was laid dormant until his body receives glorification/spotlessness. This is where we prove that Jesus was a real Son of God because if it were not this, then all these could have not happened neither could he have resurrected>

 

Consider this:

 

Who can estimate the value of a soul? Go to Gethsemane, and there watch with Jesus through those long hours of anguish when he sweat as it were great drops of blood; look upon the Saviour uplifted on the cross; hear that despairing cry, “My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?” Look upon that wounded head, the pierced side, the marred feet. Remember that Christ risked all; “tempted like as we are,” he staked even his own eternal existence upon the issue of the conflict. Heaven itself was imperiled for our redemption. At the foot of the cross, remembering that for one sinner Jesus would have yielded up his life, we may estimate the value of a soul. {GCB, December 1, 1895 par. 22}

 

Did Christ have his own spirit as we have? Yes

 

His human nature was created; it did not even possess the angelic powers. It was human, identical with our own. He was passing over the ground where Adam fell. He was now where, if He endured the test and trial in behalf of the fallen race, He would redeem Adam’s disgraceful failure and fall, in our own humanity. {CTr 213.4}

 

The human will of Christ would not have led him to the wilderness of temptation, to fast, and to be tempted of the devil. It would not have led him to endure humiliation, scorn, reproach, suffering, and death. His human nature shrank from all these things as decidedly as ours shrinks from them. He endured the contradiction of sinners against himself. The contrast between the life and character of Christ and our life and character is painful to contemplate. What did Christ live to do? It was the will of his heavenly Father. Christ left us an example, that we should follow in his steps. Are we doing it? {ST, October 29, 1894 par. 9}

 

He could be tempted. He had not taken on Him even the nature of the angels, but humanity, perfectly identical with our own nature, except without the taint of sin. A human body, a human mind, with all the peculiar properties, He was bone, brain, and muscle. A man of our flesh, He was compassed with the weakness of humanity. The circumstances of His life were of that character that He was exposed to all the inconveniences that belong to men, not in wealth, not in ease, but in poverty and want and humiliation. He breathed the very air man must breathe. He trod our earth as man. He had reason, conscience, memory, will, and affections of the human soul which was united with His divine nature. {16MR 181.4}

 

A human body and a human mind were His. He was bone of our bone and flesh of our flesh. . . . He was subject to disappointment and trial in His own home, among His own brethren. {CTr 213.5}

 

The verse that people appeal to show that the spirit of Jesus went to heaven and did not die because immortality cant die is Luke 23:46

 

And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

 

This should be harmonized with the following

 

[There was only one entrance to the tomb, and neither human fraud nor force could tamper with the stone that guarded the entrance. Here Jesus rested during the Sabbath. A strong guard of angels kept watch over the tomb, and had a hand been raised to remove the body, the flashing forth of their glory would have laid him who ventured powerless on the earth. He who died for the sins of the world was to remain in the tomb for the allotted time. He was in that stony prison house as a prisoner of divine justice, and he was responsible to the Judge of the universe. He was bearing the sins of the world, and his Father only could release him. {YI, May 2, 1901 par. 8}]

 

Suddenly the gloom lifted from the cross, and in clear, trumpetlike tones, that seemed to resound throughout creation, Jesus cried, “It is finished.” “Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit.” A light encircled the cross, and the face of the Saviour shone with a glory like the sun. He then bowed His head upon His breast, and died. {LHU 236.4}

 

Amid the awful darkness, apparently forsaken of God, Christ had drained the last dregs in the cup of human woe. In those dreadful hours He had relied upon the evidence of His Father’s acceptance heretofore given Him. He was acquainted with the character of His Father; He understood His justice, His mercy, and His great love. By faith He rested in Him whom it had ever been His joy to obey. And as in submission He committed Himself to God, the sense of the loss of His Father’s favor was withdrawn. By faith, Christ was victor (The Desire of Ages, pp. 755, 756)

 

Think about this also

 

He united humanity with divinity: a divine spirit dwelt in a temple of flesh. He united himself with the temple. “The Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us,” because by so doing he could associate with the sinful, sorrowing sons and daughters of Adam. {YI, December 20, 1900 par. 7}

 

When we talk about the laying aside of his divinity and leaving it in heaven i believe its the outward glory which he again prayed it may be given back to him in John 17

 

[But although Christ’s divine glory was for a time veiled and eclipsed by His assuming humanity, yet He did not cease to be God when He became man. The human did not take the place of the divine, nor the divine of the human. This is the mystery of godliness. The two expressions human and divine were, in Christ, closely and inseparably one, and yet they had a distinct individuality. Though Christ humbled Himself to become man, the Godhead was still His own. His Deity could not be lost while He stood faithful and true to His loyalty. …. He was ready to take once more His divine glory when His work on earth was done. {ST, May 10, 1899 par. 11}] [He trod our earth as man. He had reason, conscience, memory, will, and affections of the human soul which was united with His divine nature. {Ms57-1890}]

 

If he had two natures intrinsically tied together , did they separate at death?

 

Yes immortality did not die no one can argue with that  but does it mean it was active somewhere separated from his body? What then shall we say of this?

 

All that comprised the life and intelligence of Jesus remained with his body in the sepulcher; and when he came forth it was as a whole being; he did not have to summon his spirit from Heaven. He had power to lay down his life and to take it up again. {6Red 22.1}

 

He did not summon anything from heaven he ressurrected with the life in himself do you remember that quote?

 

When the voice of the mighty angel was heard at Christ’s tomb, saying, Thy Father calls Thee, the Saviour came forth from the grave by the life that was in Himself. Now was proved the truth of His words, “I lay down My life, that I might take it again. . . . I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again.” Now was fulfilled the prophecy He had spoken to the priests and rulers, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.” John 10:17, 18; 2:19. {DA 785.2}

 

This rendering of the divine unfunctional is what to me seems the greatest mystery of all when divinity had to depend to humanity to be alive to function, i cant say i understand all these Marcos . Still the assertions of Clayton is pure apostasy, how do you say that when we are told every now and then that his words were accompanied with divine power and that the prophets had the spirit of Christ in them? For all the people to receive the spirit, the channel has always been the Son. the only difference preincarnation is that it had not experienced humanity but still had the same power to save as pot incarnation.

 

“How much more shall the blood of Christ, who THROUGH [Gr: dia] THE ETERNAL SPIRIT offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? (Heb 9:14)

 

And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost. (Luke 23:46)

 

We know of Christ that He was “a divine spirit” in a human temple of flesh.

 

“He united humanity with divinity: a divine spirit dwelt in a temple of flesh. He united himself with the temple…. {YI December 20, 1900, par. 7}

 

His statement in Luke 23:46 is a letting go of Himself, a surrendering to the death and trusting God the Father to wake Him back to life. And even more than this it was a separation of Their oneness in spirit.

 

“As the disciples comprehended it, as their perception took hold of God’s divine compassion, they realized that there is a sense in which the sufferings of the Son were the sufferings of the Father. From eternity there was a complete unity between the Father and the Son. They were two, yet little short of being identical; two in individuality, yet one in spirit, and heart, and character. {YI December 16, 1897, par. 5}

 

“The Captain of our salvation was perfected through suffering. HIS SOUL WAS MADE AN OFFERING FOR SIN. It was necessary for THE AWFUL DARKNESS TO GATHER ABOUT HIS SOUL because of the withdrawal of the Father’s love and favor, for He was standing in the sinner’s place, and THIS DARKNESS every sinner must experience. The righteous One must suffer the condemnation and wrath of God, not in vindictiveness; for the heart of God yearned with greatest sorrow when His Son, <the Guiltless,> was suffering the penalty of sin. THIS SUNDERING OF THE DIVINE POWERS will never again occur throughout the eternal ages…. {Ms93-1899.2}

 

“It was not a dread of the physical suffering he was soon to endure that brought this agony upon the Son of God. He was enduring the penalty of man’s transgression, and shuddering beneath the Father’s frown. He must not call his divinity to his aid, but, as a man, he must bear the consequences of man’s sin and the Creator’s displeasure toward his disobedient subjects. AS HE FELT HIS UNITY WITH THE FATHER BROKEN UP, he feared that his human nature would be unable to endure the coming conflict with the prince of the power of darkness; and in that case the human race would be irrecoverably lost, Satan would be victor, and the earth would be his kingdom. The sins of the world weighed heavily upon the Saviour and bowed him to the earth; and the Father’s anger in consequence of that sin seemed crushing out his life. {3SP 95.3}

 

God the Father and His only begotten Son, who were one in spirit, Both possessing the fullness of the Godhead bodily, were sundered! They were split apart! Something happened internally between the Two. The Divine powers (Father and Son) were separated – the holy Spirit, which, though a person (internally shared person?), is the power and presence of God – something mysterious happened that level in terms of the linkage between Father and Son. And here the 2nd death was swallowed! Only a greater than all eternity future, if you will, can pay this and resurrect. This is why His resurrection is the greatest and most irrefutable proof of His Divinity!

 

As you can see the sundering is the withdrawal of the Father’ love and favor and unity with the Father broken

 

Laying aside his royal robe and kingly crown, Christ clothed his divinity with humanity, that human beings might be raised from their degradation, and placed on vantage-ground. Christ could not have come to this earth with the glory that he had in the heavenly courts. Sinful human beings could not have borne the sight. He veiled his divinity with the garb of humanity, “but he did not part with his divinity.” A divine-human Saviour, he came to stand at the head of the fallen race, to share in their experience from childhood to manhood. That human beings might be partakers of the divine nature, he came to this earth, and lived a life of perfect obedience. {RH, June 15, 1905 par. 12}

 

BLESSINGS

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